The Bull weekend of 6 15 to 17

[blackZZR]

Do you have any pictures of the area that you're referring to above?

If it's on the trail, I'll talk to Waywegoes about blocking it back off. If "spectators" have widened a "parking" off what we've established as the trail edges, they are off the trail (and subject to citation for violating the DVR)

the area is where 3n32 hits 3n10, 75 feet west of there is a place the trail has been made 75 feet wide
there used to be a narrow trail that had to pass over some single rocks going up to the gate keeper area, now the main trail is shifted over to the left going around a few trees and allowing guys with street rigs to access the gate keeper area.
up untill this year, this was always a narrow place that turned guys around, however, like I posted earlier, just after purchasing my jeep, while it was still on 29s with open diffs I popped over these rocks like they were speed bumps.

[Old Fart]

Jim, is this an area I can get to (or close to) with my F350 Crewcab (4x4)

I'll be up in Big Bear this weekend for Kids on Public Lands, could pop over and take a look.

[blackZZR]

pmed you

[ECV Jeep]

Jim, is this an area I can get to (or close to) with my F350 Crewcab (4x4)

I'll be up in Big Bear this weekend for Kids on Public Lands, could pop over and take a look.

Sorry to just jump into this thread, but I have been following it closely. Jeff, if you need a ride to look over the area in question, I can probably take you there. I will be at KOPL all weekend myself, mostly around the Discovery Center (Cass has asked that I help with a gold panning demonstration). I will attempt to search you out an introduce myself this weekend. If you get a chance, and you see a red CJ7 Laredo, drop by and say hello.

-Brian

[Russ Chung]

Sorry to just jump into this thread, but I have been following it closely. Jeff, if you need a ride to look over the area in question, I can probably take you there. I will be at KOPL all weekend myself, mostly around the Discovery Center (Cass has asked that I help with a gold panning demonstration). I will attempt to search you out an introduce myself this weekend. If you get a chance, and you see a red CJ7 Laredo, drop by and say hello.

-Brian

Brian/Jeff, I plan to be at KOPL on Saturday; maybe we can all go over there and take a look.

[Old Fart]

I'll be taking the big truck up tonight - will catch up with you folks tomorrow. Would definately like a ride over to 3N10 to check this out.

213.820.0556

[Mtbikbob]

Great Pictures Barker, well done.

As far as the rest of this thread....hmmmm last time I said anything a difficult trail, the response was, "you want difficult, go to Johnson Valley...The Hammers". Anyway, good thoughts all around, continuing the discussion to all who come around MJR to help educate is a good thing. I continue to learn good trail etiquette, by being here as well. So, thanks for the education.

[Russ Chung]

John Bull Gatekeeper report - June 23

the area is where 3n32 hits 3n10, 75 feet west of there is a place the trail has been made 75 feet wide there used to be a narrow trail that had to pass over some single rocks going up to the gate keeper area, now the main trail is shifted over to the left going around a few trees and allowing guys with street rigs to access the gate keeper area. Up until this year, this was always a narrow place that turned guys around, however, like I posted earlier, just after purchasing my jeep, while it was still on 29s with open diffs I popped over these rocks like they were speed bumps.

Following the Kids on Public Lands event at the Big Bear Discovery Center on Saturday, Brian (ECV Jeep), Jeff (Old Fart) and I went over to the John Bull trail (2N10) to inspect the area that Jim (BlackZZR) mentioned in his earlier post in this thread. Jeff has been designated by SBNF to do all the trail surveys for the Mountaintop district. Jeff didn't want to take his F350 Superduty out there, so he rode along with Brian. This is the trail marker at the intersection of 3N32 and 2N10:
[SIZED]http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b53/UF92134/Big%20Bear%202007-Jun-23/P1060223.jpg[/SIZED]

Just west of the intersection is this wide area at the bottom of the Gatekeeper. Jeff (Old Fart) is inspecting the area.


This photo looks back along 2N10 toward the intersection of 3N32 and 2N10:


We were not sure which bypass Jim (BlackZZR) was referring to. In my opinion, the multiple bypasses at the base of Gatekeeper are necessary so that "a jeep with 31's, appropriate lift and a single rear locker" could make it through the obstacle, but that's up to Jeff to determine.

[Russ Chung]

Although my Jeep doesn't meet the minimum criteria that Jeff uses in determining the trail maintenance plan (I have 31s and a 2.5 inch lift, but I'm open at both ends), I persuaded Jeff and Brian to let me try to take my Jeep up through the obstacle. Because it was late in the day, we planned to go to the top of the first hill and turn around. I managed to get stuck once going up (no pictures) and once coming down. Brian had to pull me off each time. I don't blame the trail or my Jeep; getting stuck was due to driver error:


Here are a few more pictures of Brian (ECV Jeep) on the John Bull trail (2N10):




Just after Brian pulled me free, a group of about a half dozen rigs from San Diego's Just Runs came down the obstacle. MJR member Dave Hatch (dhsundance) was part of the group, and managed to "park" his Jeep on another rock:



One of the rigs behind him pulled him off the rocks; we departed before the rest of the rigs made it through.

[blackZZR]

the bottom of the gatekeeper trail has been divided for years
before you get to the clearing there in the pictures was the area I was talking about, between there and the y section, for as many years as I have been going up there it has been a single track thru some rocks, this year it has a bypass. Last sunday, there were also many many rocks set up on the bottom of gatekeper, to make it easy to get over, which were not there the friday evening before. from the looks of some opf those pictures, they have been moved.
THe problem I knew we would have, is communication, maybe going out there together would have been better.
Anyway, how was rest of the trail?

[Russ Chung]

the bottom of the gatekeeper trail has been divided for years
before you get to the clearing there in the pictures was the area I was talking about, between there and the y section, for as many years as I have been going up there it has been a single track thru some rocks, this year it has a bypass. Last sunday, there were also many many rocks set up on the bottom of gatekeper, to make it easy to get over, which were not there the friday evening before. from the looks of some opf those pictures, they have been moved.
The problem I knew we would have, is communication, maybe going out there together would have been better.
Anyway, how was rest of the trail?

OH! Could you be referring to this area, about 100 yds BEFORE the junction of 3N32 and 2N10:



We only went about 1/4 mile up the trail, then turned around, so I can't give you much of a report on the rest of the trail. I can tell you that I only had trouble at the bottom of the Gatekeeper. I've learned that the difference between success and failure on a rocky trail is a matter of inches; after Brian pulled me off the first "stuck" (not pictured), I moved about six inches to the right, and got through. On the second "stuck" (pictured), I got careless because it was at the end of the tough part and I wasn't paying attention.

[blackZZR]

OH! Could you be referring to this area, about 100 yds BEFORE the junction of 3N32 and 2N10:



We only went about 1/4 mile up the trail, then turned around, so I can't give you much of a report on the rest of the trail. I can tell you that I only had trouble at the bottom of the Gatekeeper. I've learned that the difference between success and failure on a rocky trail is a matter of inches; after Brian pulled me off the first "stuck" (not pictured), I moved about six inches to the right, and got through. On the second "stuck" (pictured), I got careless because it was at the end of the tough part and I wasn't paying attention.

when you come off the first section of the bull and meet 3n32, going east to west, there is a small staging area, you go west to the area first pictured(botom of gtekeeper) between there, is a area much like the one in your last post. Last year it was a single track over a few rocks, now it is as wide as that picture. Now what concerns me, is that like trails I have seen closed because of bypasses, is that it keeps getting wider and wider. The Bull is a Jewel of a trail, and the issues it seems to be having now are not nessacerly those caused by guys who can do it, but by those who cannot that want to access places to watch. I am concerned about bypasses as at adopt a trail meetings we are taught to report them so they can be blocked and trails can stay open. I would prefer a open forum at the SBNFA to do such as I feel discussion here , while can be useful, is not the full intent of the board. However, Jeff is the only way I know to get a message to SBNFA OHV group about these issues
If I am wrong, Sarah edit me out, I respect your board and think your moderation of it has always been top notch.

[dhsundance]

Russ-

It was really fun runnning into you guys. Thanks for the pic on the 'parking' spot. At least I know where the first scratch on my belly up skid came from.

Dave

[Mtbikbob]

As always Russ....great photos.

[Old Fart]

Looking at the trail on Sat (thanks to Russ and especially Brian for the ride), there aren't any bypasses that weren't there when I wrote the MP. At one time (4-5 years ago) there was a huge bypass way to the right of the gatekeeper that we blocked off - I haven't seen tracks of anything in there since (except Mr No Shoulders).

Jim, as far as a forum to discuss trail conditions - you might want to attend the next Adopt a Trail meeting in Corona, I can introduce you to the folks from Waywegoes, who maintain that trail. With the exception of the two AAT Coordinators (Myself for Big Bear, and Ted Kalil for the rest of the SBNF), it's not an "OHV Volunteer issue", except for the two trails that the Volunteers have an AAT agreement for.

If you get back up there in the near future, shoot some puctures specifically of what you're speaking of.