10/25/03 Black or Blue...ideas?...open invitation

[jmbrowning]

Alas, looks like Cleghorn is out on account of fire. The Missus is interested in wheelin a black or blue that weekend. She'll be driving the Rubi.

My brother is also going to be in town and is interested in checking out 4x in general. I will see if I can find a place that might rent a Jeep/truck for my brother (any ideas?) If he can't find anything, he may need to sit on the tools

Thinking about doing a trail that has lots of options for difficulty depending on what the Wife wants to do and what the rental company will tolerate.

Cleghorn seemed ideal, any other ideas? Is Pilot Rock Road closed also? Max difficulty would be Holcomb Creek/John Bull.

[goodtimes]

I ran Pilot Rock from 2n17x up to arrowhead, it was really easy, with a couple of optional, moderate obsticals. There was patchy snow when I was on it, so that made it a little more interesting.

[Baja Sixer]

Have you run the trail that starts just north of Silverwood Lake and ends up in Lake Arrowhead? It's been two or three years since I've been on it. I have a friend coming from AZ the weekend of the 25th for some wheeling. Maybe we can hook up w/ you all.

[sarah]

Originally posted by Baja Sixer
Have you run the trail that starts just north of Silverwood Lake and ends up in Lake Arrowhead? It's been two or three years since I've been on it. I have a friend coming from AZ the weekend of the 25th for some wheeling. Maybe we can hook up w/ you all.

yeah, that trail rocks. it goes along the ridge there? ROCK!

[goodtimes]

There are 2 ways to get from Silverwood to arrowhead. Either take pilot rock the whole way, or take 2n17x to pilot rock. They both start at the same spot (Silverwood dam), 2n17x branches off to the left (well marked, and quite obvious intersection), and is the tougher of the 2 routes. The hardest obsticals have bypasses. The last little climb at the end of 2n17x can be challenging when it is wet &/or covered in snow, but the trail is do-able with a stock SUV. The 2 trails come back together at another obvious (and marked) intersection.

Based on the easiest route on the trail (which is how trails are generally rated), 2n17x does not deserve the black "most difficult" rating that it has recieved. It is more like a blue "more difficult" trail, now that there is a bypass for the one big climb that made it difficult.

[sarah]

baja, is this your friend that started the "baja sixers?"

goodtimes, agreed. there is that one steep hill that's practically impossible to climb, but it's got a bypass anyway. i think that would be a good one to run, fun, but not too hard or too easy.

[blkTJ]

How about Last Chance?

[MIKE89YJ]

2N17X Stock SUV ???

Greetings Goodtimes,

I led a group of 11 jeeps over this trail on Mothers Day and although we all made it over the trail I can't say that I agree with your statement about stock SUV's. At the last steep hill climb we came across two Jeep Cherokees that could not make it to the top. They had "stock" highway tires and could not get any traction on the loose soil. They ended up going back the way they came.

The reason the forest service rated it a black diamond trail is because we get these people up here that have a 4x4 but are not 4 Wheelers. They think just because they have 4 wheel drive they can go anywhere. You would be surprised what we see on these trails.

I agree that it isn't too difficult "IF" you know what you are doing.

May I suggest that you take 2N17X up to 2N33, take 2N33 west to 2N34, take 2N34 down to 2N37, 2N37 east to hwy 138. Take hwy 138 west a short distance to the Cottonwood Ranger Station. From the ranger station take 2N45 up to 2N49, take 2N49 east to Monument Peak. From here you can continue down 2N49 to the forest boundry. The trail ends at a paved road (sorry I don't remember the name). The paved road will lead straight to the 215 freeway near the entrance to Glen Helen cycle park. This run makes for a nice loop if you live south of the Cajon Pass.

[Baja Sixer]

That's him, he wants to do some So Cal wheeling. We have't run the Big Bear area in a while so we are ready!

[goodtimes]

I have been with rookie drivers on that trail. We did have some difficulty getting heavy rigs with questionable tires and open diffs up that last climb when it was wet and sloppy, but nothing too bad (everyone did it under their own power). In good weather (dry trail) I haven't had any trouble with that last climb (save for the line on the right, I did get hung up on a rock over there once ).

I feel that using the "most difficult" rating on that trail will give people a misconception of what a "most difficult" trail is. If someone new to the off road scene runs 2n17x, and has few or no problems with it (a very likely situation), then heads up Dishpan Springs or John Bull expecting to see the same thing, they are in for a rude awakening. Dishpan Springs sees 12 - 14 roll overs each year. Many of them by rookie drivers who are in over their heads. IMO, you cannot say that both 2n17x and dishpan springs are even close in difficulty. Again, IMO, trails should be rated by the easiest line on the most difficult obstical. So if you take all the bypasses on 2n17x, you can just about do it in 2 wheel drive (assuming the trail is dry--and yes, I have done most of that trail in 2wd).

[jmbrowning]

Dollar has TJ rentals...

Well, Dollar has TJ rentals so that probably covers my brother's ride. It will be fun to see how AT tires run at 15 psi

The loop sounds interesting and I will check it out on the topos and call the Forest Service to see what is open out there.

Last Chance is a bit too East and I'm a bit bummed I never got to meet Tonie

If Cleghorn or Pilot Rock isn't feasible, alternate ideas include:[list=1][*]Cucamonga Big Tree Trail - 1N34 (Wells #28)[*]Pronghorn Trail in the Hungry Valley OHV Park- Gorman (Wells #14)[/list=1]

I prefer the scenery of the National Forest trails but the OHV park has multiple obstacles for people who want a bit more challenge than the rental unit.

[Chris_L]

You guys should check out last chance canyon. It's pretty basic, and all the obsticles are optional. Easy ride with lots of scenery.

[jmbrowning]

All East of 38 open, parts West of 38 closed

Cleghorn is out for the rest of the year according to the USFS. Everything east of the 38 is open.

Definitely want to make the pilgrimage to Last Chance Canyon, before the Feds cart it all away. Perhaps later this autumn.

[TJP]

Originally posted by goodtimes
I ran Pilot Rock from 2n17x up to arrowhead, it was really easy, with a couple of optional, moderate obsticals. There was patchy snow when I was on it, so that made it a little more interesting.

If this trip is going to happen please add some details. I have three Jeeps that want to do this trip. I'm pretty sure we are going to go pilot rock to Arrowhead on 10-25. It would be fun to have more vehicles.

[sarah]

i think it's going to be last chance ... see this thread.

http://www.myjeeprocks.com/forums/sh...=&threadid=747