Are you "armed" on the trail ??

[NAILER341]

here is a bit of reading for you

CARRYING AND TRANSPORTATION IN VEHICLES

Carrying a handgun concealed within a vehicle is prohibited without a license. A handgun carried in a glove compartment or under the seat of a vehicle is considered to be concealed. A handgun placed in the trunk of an automobile, or locked in a container in the vehicle other than the utility or glove compartment or while in a locked container carried directly to or from a vehicle is deemed not to be "concealed." A locked container means a fully enclosed secure container locked by a key lock or similar locking device.

Exceptions to this prohibition are:

1. Members of clubs organized for practice shooting while on any established target range or going to and from such range.

2. Licensed hunters and fishermen while engaged in hunting or fishing and while going to or from such hunting or fishing expeditions.

3. Members of an antique or historical collector`s club while at a show, or while going to and from a display as long as the weapons are locked in a trunk or are in a locked container.


http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/StateLaws.aspx?ST=CA

http://www.packing.org/state/index.jsp/california
here is where you can apply for a CCW permit, and do it legally.
good luck getting it though. they dont like to give them out in california too easily.

Open Carry information: Open carry is permitted if you have a permit to carry, but only if you are in a county with a population of less than 200,000 as of the last census. It is your responsibility to know the population. Open carry is nearly unheard of, so be prepared to have an encounter with local law enforcement officers.

The most recent records released by the California Department of Justice (2003) indicate that there are a total of 45,120 current CCW permits within the state. Individual counties are listed below in the locality section.

Please note: Contrary to popular belief, CCW permits are in fact issued within the State of California. The decision is made by appointed city law enforcement or elected county law enforcement. Cities generally defer the decision to the County Sheriff; therefore, the chance of issuance varies from county to county, and from elected Sheriff to elected Sheriff. Keep that in mind when you vote.

CLICK HERE FOR THE OFFICIAL CCW APPLICATION, AND REQUIREMENTS.
it is in pdf format.

[seapahn]

I carry mine on occasion but it's always locked in the back security console and unloaded until I am camping somewhere (usually if alone). I have usually not felt the need when wheeling with a group around southern cali or moab ... but when camping in a place like anza borrego by myself (near the border), I do keep it loaded by my side in the tent just in case.

And I'm getting sick and tired of hearing of Ammendments when talking about guns. Right shmright ... discuss the matter with intelligence as screams of "right to bear arms" is getting a bit tiring. I am neither a gun freak nor an anti-gun hippie. I am 100% for responsible usage and ownership.

[paulhead]

im more of the mcgyver type

weapons of choice:
paper clip
1/4 of a napkin
a birthday candle
and gum wrapper

with these things i can easily kill a bear or disarm a nuclear dirty bomb, take that terrorist!

HA!!

[Dukes69]

I guess it seems contridictory...I should have said "lockable" center console in my 1st post. But that wouldn't have given you an opportunity to post something.

Why even say lockable at all?

I think its a better opportunity to watch you backpedal!

[rick]

http://www.packing.org/state/index.jsp/california
here is where you can apply for a CCW permit, and do it legally.
good luck getting it though. they dont like to give them out in california too easily.

The most recent records released by the California Department of Justice (2003) indicate that there are a total of 45,120 current CCW permits within the state. Individual counties are listed below in the locality section.

Please note: Contrary to popular belief, CCW permits are in fact issued within the State of California. The decision is made by appointed city law enforcement or elected county law enforcement. Cities generally defer the decision to the County Sheriff; therefore, the chance of issuance varies from county to county, and from elected Sheriff to elected Sheriff. Keep that in mind when you vote.

Yah, CA is about impossible. Out of 10 million people, there are 45k with ccw permits. The only way you can get a permit in CA, as far as I know, is if you are a business owner and have to carry large quantities of cash or other valuable items on a regular basis. That, or you are a cop. I'm sure the 45k includes those that are law enforcement or other government officials carrying for personal protection. That means the actual regular joes that are carrying are a very small portion of the total populace. I personally am all for responsible CCW, and if I thought I could get a permit I would probably apply just for the sake of having the ability to do it if I felt the need.

It is also an amazing deterrent to crime - just the possibility of the general populace carrying greatly impacts the psyche of the average criminal. Think: "hmmm, I wonder if that guy is packin..." Back in 1993, a group of punks were hanging out at Florida airports waiting to mug foreign tourists that came out. If you just walked off a plane, there is very little likelihood that you are carrying, particularly if coming from a foreign country. They had memorized the foreign flight schedules so they knew when to look for foreigners. The thugs, when apprehended, admitted this as their primary reason for preying on airport patrons. Criminals aren't stupid - they don't want to be shot any more than you or I. Since Florida has quite relaxed CCW laws, these guys saw foreigners as their easiest, safest target.

All that said, anyone that carries in a manner inconsistent with CCW laws is a moron. If you keep an unlocked gun in the passenger compartment, you are simply begging to be caught (is your taillight out?). If you are caught, you will have a felony record which will prohibit you from OWNING a gun legally. I would say that if you actually fear (I know, you do not live in fear) that some(one, thing, ?) is a threat to you while on the trail, you ought to carry a big ass hammer in the passenger compartment. It comes in handy for other things too. If you feel the need to sleep with a pistola under your pillow, by all means do so, but keep it legal when in the vehicle. But if you are the drinking type, I suggest you leave the guns at home. I had a friend in college that used to sleep with his pistol under his pillow and he almost blew his roomate's head off one night after a lengthy bender. Things just don't seem the same through beer goggles I guess.

If you want to do something productive, write your representatives about the fact that Florida's murder rate dropped from 14% above the national average to 3% below the national average after passing their relaxed CCW laws. The amazing part is - the actual percentage of the FL populace with CCW permits only increased a measly 4% in the 5 years after they passed the laws.

Just my $0.02 1/2.

:shades:

[goodtimes]

When I am out 'wheeling with a group of people, I don't carry any weapons. I don't feel a need to (safety in numbers, plus there is a higher chance of alcohol being consumed in camp). If I am out exploring/camping alone, then I do carry a weapon, within the laws of Arizona (where you can get a CCW by taking a 2 day class, submitting the appropriate paperwork and waiting on the background check). I have never had a reason to use any of the weapons I have with me, other than for some target shooting when the mood strikes me. But you never know......

[mikeythefireman]

Getting a CCW in CA is as hard as it can be in any state with CCW laws. Meaning, you have to have a reason other than paranoia to need one (Shall issue rather than will issue). It's not a matter of satisfying some high and mighty state official, it's a matter of satisfying a local police official. Any local authorized police official in CA. Many of my former (well, former in two days) Navy coworkers went to some podunk town by Bakersfield whose police chief issued to all active and retired military members who met the other state criteria.


I don't feel carrying on the trail is necessary. But I've always wheeled with pretty good sized groups or in areas where I felt very secure against bad guys. Now that I'm in WA state (a will issue state) I'm going to get my CCW and I will reconsider carrying. But I'll probably only carry when we're headed way back in the boonies and I hear the sounds of banjos on a regular basis.

[jmbrowning]

Getting a CCW in SoCal is as easy as getting a residence in OC, San Berdoo, Kern, or Riverside Co. LAC will not issue. It required an act of the County Board of Directors to get LAPD Chief Willie Wilkins a CCW (he couldn't pass the firearm quals).

CCW in other states is plenty simple and I don't think there is anything WRONG with packing as long as you are not endangering others or yourself (particularly your own right to keep and bear arms in the future, if busted without a CCW permit).

Having said that, a .22 or .410 will usually accompany me on most forays into the outdoors as there is usually SOMETHING that is in season, even if it is only a tasty little treat like a Tree Rat. I don't know if you would consider that "armed" or just "sportin'".

[NAILER341]

i think the description of armed would be having a loaded firearm within reach.
transporting a firearm in your vehicle according to the ca. laws is not armed.
ca law requires gun to be in a locked box seperate from ammo.

then once you get where you are going, you holster up, and wear your gun around camp all you want as long as it is exposed.

where the law gets bolken is concielment, and loaded in the vehicle.

i am the last person to be against guns. i really enjoy having them, and using them. i do think the "need" for having a loaded gun in the console of your jeep while wheeling with your friends is a bit out there.

i think we should arrange a trip to the desert, and bring a bunch of guns, and ammo, and shoot up a storm.
bear in mind alcohol and firearms dont mix. so lets plan on a booze free day of shooting

[blkTJ]

Even I'd sober up for that. :yay:

[Guest]

Thanks for all the info and wonderful replies everyone. This thread was just a way for me to understand how people here feel about some things, especially if I accompany folks from here on any Jeep adventures.

And Chris got me to sorta of back pedal......LOL !!

[Hanzo]

Just as a point of interest.

This is a grey zone as far as concealed carry goes. When camping, your campsite is temporarily designated as your place of residence and you are always permitted to carry a loaded firearm in your place of residence. This is why a CCW is not necessary while camping.

IF you have your camping supplies with you, it could be (and has) been argued that you are moving with your place of residence and therefore have the right to carry a loaded firearm. True, it's not exactly in the spirit of the law, but the issue has not been settled legally. So, it would be incorrect to state that he would be doing anything illegal.

As far as would I do it? Yes, probably. Do I feel I NEED to? No. But why are people so scared of guns? As was said earlier, it's a tool. Near the border it's a good thing to have for protection. (ask the Texas residents who were sleeping soundly when a Mexican drug cartel came across their home. Opps, you can't, they're all dead) In other places, it could be used for an emergency signal if need be (not the best emergency signal, but it does the job) and if stranded for long periods of time, can be used to hunt with. And, assuming you're responsible with your firearms, what can it hurt?

[king4wd2]

im more of the mcgyver type

weapons of choice:
paper clip
1/4 of a napkin
a birthday candle
and gum wrapper

with these things i can easily kill a bear or disarm a nuclear dirty bomb, take that terrorist!

You forgot to mention Duct Tape. MacGyver always had duct tape with him.